DreamLyrics™ Play-by-Post Forums Fantasy SKT: The Storm King's Thunder OOC thread

Zeim's in Nashville and we're in New York. It was crude. It did work.

I tried running FTF with some of the DreamLyrics players on Roll20. The challenge was Roll20 training. I was considering it for this game for the melees but finding a date and time to do it would be the first challenge. I'm not sure that there's interest but a 2 month encounter could be tackled in a single session. I'll leave the option open.

BTW, verbal communication is the biggest issue. I've learned that the best practice is to use Roll20 for the gaming desktop and using Discord for voice.

I feel yer pain Nep. We are spread across lots of time zones and we each have the things that take us away from here which are ... sadly ... seldom synchronized <sigh>

I would drive 3 hours each way once a month, and spend the night, to play ftf. It's a 15 hour drive for me. A bit much to do.

MikeD,

If there ever was a good time, it would be on a weekend day. It would be morning for me, early morning for those west of me and afternoon for those across the pond. 10 am here, is 9 am in Indy and Nashville, 3 pm in England.

However, as you said, coordination schedules is beyond difficult. It would have to be planned WAY in advance.

Or we just keep on with what has been working for a =very= long time <wink>

But it might be fun to try and schedule something here ... if not 'real time' ... at least 'coordinated' so that we could do a lot of 'near time' posts <g>

About Zhentarim....

Zeim's response in the IC thread is appropriate. Note that she too flaunts her faction, wearing a silver pendant that identifies her as a member of the Order of the Gautlet. Most of you, during the interlude, learned about objectives for your factions if you picked one. I did this on purpose. It's something I can't do in a FTF game but our PBP format really lends itself to develop a richness to the interpersonal relationships of PC's. It should make for some interesting roleplaying opportunities. Because I've decided to take this track, I will, once again, caution everyone about metagaming. You'll need to decide how your PC feels about members of other factions.

I think it's fair to share how I think about the Zhents. They have evolved from evil-doers who worshiped evil gods and did evil things to what they are now. This web site has some good background that is pretty current

I want to highlight one line: "By 1489 DR, the Zhentarim have mostly become a mercenary organization, taking contracts for pay as Manshoon attempts to rebuild the Zhents into a major force once again". For perspective, see the Calendar thread in SKT Lore.

Are they evil? Some of your PC's will have preconceived notions about the Zhents. It might be your choice or it might be because of how your faction perceives them. Since they are now a mercenary organization, there are many Zhents that are out in the open. Many of the the caravan guards, especially those better armed, might be Zhents. It is possible that you encounter a group of Zhents. Your prejudices might drive you to want to attack. But consider this. If you thought that Nazis and white supremacists were evil and you saw someone walking down the street waving a flag with a swastika, would you try to kill them?

Think about it also as to how it applies to this game. Consider that it's also likely that they have information that is unavailable to other factions because of their associations with the underbelly of society. Consider that they have helped the causes of good when it served their purposes.

It takes really good roleplayers to pull off handling these types of scenarios. I wouldn't have gone down this route if I didn't think you were all really good roleplayers.

Well, I =might= think really hard about it ... and that is in =this= world. In the world of our game, I can certainly imagine someone ... personally affected by bad 'past actions' ... getting carried away ... and deciding to 'serve justice' <g>

I can =also= imagine that a lot of such people would =NOT= be buying into the whole 'kinder, gentler Zent' propaganda <weg>

All that is true. Each person will have their own beliefs. Upbringing and backgrounds certainly has an impact.

I had a player once who was playing (what was supposed to be) a Lawful Good character and wanted to own slaves. We had an argument about it. I was brought up to believe that slavery is purely evil - period. That person wasn't.

Yes, the whole argument about moral relativism. Is there an absolute definition of good and evil or is good and evil defined by the times and culture a person is brought up and lives in? And if there IS an absolute definition of good and evil, how do we know that what we believe is not evil today will not be seen as evil by future generations?

Well yes. I think D&D's alignment system was probably meant to mean something in the fiction originally but as gamers and games have matured, it's become just another tag, like piercing, slashing, fire, cold, arcane, necrotic, etc. etc..

We had a nice scene in LMP that revolved around alignment perspective, if you recall. When Chandan (Neutral Good iirc) executed the Redbrand abductor (or tried to, can't remember if he was successful), after discovering their child captive beneath Tresendar Manor.

Fantasy isn't actually a favourite genre of mine, believe it or not, so when I read about abducted children I think more about modern crime thrillers. Killing a child's parents and holding the child captive in a dungeon to be abused conjures crimes that are beyond evil in my mind. As an NG character, with a history involving failing to protect a young child, I reasoned Chandan would believe the best thing he could do for the world was execute the culprits, thus guaranteeing they could never commit such a crime again.

Of course, in most people's minds, executing prisoners is tantamount to evil. But reality, and the fictive reality we create for our characters, is rarely so black & white as D&D alignments imply.

I agree 100%.
Do good folks do any bad things? Do bad people do any good things? The answer, IMO, is yes.

There is a lot of 'wiggle room' in that whole 'good vs evil' debate.

Our government =KILLS= lots of people every year because 'they' believe that they are 'evil' and will do more 'evil' if left free to act as they wish. Would you like the child molesters and such to 'roam free'??

Nep is right that no one is perfectly 'good' or perfectly 'evil'. The question is where you 'draw the line'. We could 'kill everyone' because =anyone= =could= do 'evil. But that seems like a bad idea <weg> So we make our best guess based on the actions of those 'others'.

The fact that D&D 'alignments' tend to be 'absolute' is something of a 'convenience' for the game ... IMHO. If we were put in the position of having to 'judge' the actions of everyone we encountered, there wouldn't be much 'action'. No. D&D was designed to give us the 'freedom' to enforce our character's own 'ideals' ... because 'we', the players, do not have that luxury <sigh>

Not to mention that D&D began as an action based, heavy combat/adventuring game. The Role playing aspect grew over time as some people started to not want to play caricatures. Plus combat in D&D is all based on reaction. The side who goes first, either thru surprise or initiative, has a tremendous advantage.

So, in a dungeon setting, you turn a corner and see an Orc, knowing Orc=Evil so kill it, allows you to act instead of turning the corner and seeing a person whose outlook on life you want to determine before you decide how to act.

I think the filmmakers did a superb job of making orcs unquestionably evil in The Lord of the Rings films.

The goblins in Moria attack first, asking no questions and offering no quarter, for example.

And it was clever how they showed the first act of an Uruk-hai being born, was to strangle one its 'nurses'. And at every mention Saruman makes of pain and suffering, the Uruk-hai seemed a little excited by the idea.

By the time Saruman despatches them from Isengard, you're in no doubt that these are some bad dudes and there's no parleying with them.

All greatly helped by Weta's amazing goblin/orc designs, that made them like mutated forms of life rather than natural creatures.

Yes. I also liked how Saruman's realm of Isengard was depicted as a manufactory. It aligns with Tolkien's metaphor of LOTR representing the problems of mechanization. Automation and mechanization was the "evil" of the world (i.e. Saruman, Sauron, Orcs, etc) while those who loved nature (Elves, Halflings) were the good guys.

It's fair to say that a historian and scholar of the realms might well look at anything that voluntarily clings to the name 'Zhent' with a leery eye, especially one with no faith in redemption and a tendency to think the worst of certain people.

I don't disagree AJ. But there could be others who are willing to give them a chance to prove that they have turned over a new leaf, as it were <g> It is about what 'they' have been doing to show that 'new leaf' to the world <wink>

Just a couple of quick notes.

1) I doubt that I'll be posting Fri-Sun as I'm traveling to Tampa to watch baseball with my brother.
2) Pandemonium has returned! I've offered him a choice of letting Luminmorn rejoin or of playing a completely new PC. I'll keep y'all posted!

WB Pande!!!! Missed ya buddy!!

Btw, on the alignment discussion, I just bought a new t-shirt for my first official D&D* DMing since 2005!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/D20-Chaotic-Neutral-Alignment-Tabletop/dp/B07PY7HJJC/ref=sr_1_36

*OK, so I have run 13th Age and Dungeon World since then, which are almost D&D.

Nice! I love that shirt!

Nice!

Sadly ... I did not see what I would need ... a 'chaotic insane' T <sigh>

Hi Folks,
Thanks for the WB! I might have to get one of those T-shirts, that is awesome.

Regarding my return. Would folks like to see Lumi continue? Or do we want/need something else in the party? Nep has pointed out that in 5E things are a little more balanced, so need is a relative term. However, ...